What happens if Argentina gets too expensive? What are alternative cities/countries to move to when it's overpriced in Argentina?

[mc kenna]

As a couple or single person with paid off place one can live off $1600/mo.


Even less so if you remove cleaning and delivery services. Would be too bare bones for many - add in travel, entertainment, etc and cost goes back up.

When you figure that the majority of Argentines make less than 1 million pesos a month which is only about $725 it is not surprising to say one can get by here for less than that.

The reality is that is not much money to be comfortable here. A good point to be made is monthly hoa fees in many buildings are a few hundred dollars a month now. Not even for anything fancy. Also don't think he included amount he spent going out to eat at restaurants. Hell even for going out to coffee can add up each day.

That grocery budget does not sound realistic with 4 people in the house. Even if you own a car you will end up spending a lot of money on parking around.

Also don't see any budget for expenses for the kids. All my friends complain about the cost of clothing for their kids.

 

[earlyretirement]

As a couple or single person with paid off place one can live off $1600/mo.


Even less so if you remove cleaning and delivery services. Would be too bare bones for many - add in travel, entertainment, etc and cost goes back up.

The median salary in Argentina is very low. The fact that he pays so little to his nanny shows you just how low salaries are. I know BowTied Mara and he is a great guy. I meet up and have a meal with him each trip. Still, as a father with 3 kids I can tell you that there are a bunch of things left off on that list. I don't believe that amount for groceries for 2 kids and a family of 4.

He also put on that, he didn't include amounts dining out. I am a #'s guy and if you're making a budget I'd include all of these things. I don't see a lot of different expenses related to the kids. I had 2 kids born in Buenos Aires and my youngest lived there until she was 3 and we had a ton of expenses for the kids. Obviously, life is much cheaper without kids but I've found that when most people are making a budget like this they are vastly underestimating actual expenses each month.

-Rent (if you don't own your property)
- Property taxes if you own
-Phone (Land line and Cell phone)
- Utilities (gas, water, electricity, cable, internet, etc)
- HOA fees/expensas each month
- Maintenance and repairs (if you own a property)
- Car payments
- Car insurance
- Auto Fuel each month for each car
- Registration fees for your car each year
- Maintenance on your car to include car washes and oil changes
-Parking (various times when you're out and about plus if you don't have a garage in your apartment and have to rent one)
- Home/rental insurance for your property
- Life insurance
- Health insurance premiums
- Dental insurance premiums
- Medical/Dental expenses (what insurance won't cover)
- Prescription medications
- School expenses for kids if applicable (tuition, stuff for school, ballet classes, etc)
- Babysitter expenses
- Annual fee for Credit Cards
- Clothes for kids and yourself
- Toys for kids
- Dry Cleaning
- Health club / gym
- Taxi/Uber fares which are inevitable.
- Beauty (hair salon for hair cuts, color, nails, make up, etc)
- Extracurricular activities dues/fees
- Entertainment (movies, theatre, plays, Zoo, concerts, sporting events, etc --)
- Magazine/newspaper/Ipad subscriptions
- Dining out at restaurants
- Grocery budget
- Retirement savings contributions
- Kids college fund savings contributions
- Charity/donations
- Travel / vacation expenses
- Federal/State/local income taxes
- Any revolving debt payments you might have
- Bad habit type stuff (alcohol, smoking, etc)
- Emergency savings fund for any major health issues
- Non reimbursed office/work expenses and supplies

 

[Betsy Ross]

The median salary in Argentina is very low. The fact that he pays so little to his nanny shows you just how low salaries are. I know BowTied Mara and he is a great guy. I meet up and have a meal with him each trip. Still, as a father with 3 kids I can tell you that there are a bunch of things left off on that list. I don't believe that amount for groceries for 2 kids and a family of 4.

He also put on that, he didn't include amounts dining out. I am a #'s guy and if you're making a budget I'd include all of these things. I don't see a lot of different expenses related to the kids. I had 2 kids born in Buenos Aires and my youngest lived there until she was 3 and we had a ton of expenses for the kids. Obviously, life is much cheaper without kids but I've found that when most people are making a budget like this they are vastly underestimating actual expenses each month.

-Rent (if you don't own your property)
- Property taxes if you own
-Phone (Land line and Cell phone)
- Utilities (gas, water, electricity, cable, internet, etc)
- HOA fees/expensas each month
- Maintenance and repairs (if you own a property)
- Car payments
- Car insurance
- Auto Fuel each month for each car
- Registration fees for your car each year
- Maintenance on your car to include car washes and oil changes
-Parking (various times when you're out and about plus if you don't have a garage in your apartment and have to rent one)
- Home/rental insurance for your property
- Life insurance
- Health insurance premiums
- Dental insurance premiums
- Medical/Dental expenses (what insurance won't cover)
- Prescription medications
- School expenses for kids if applicable (tuition, stuff for school, ballet classes, etc)
- Babysitter expenses
- Annual fee for Credit Cards
- Clothes for kids and yourself
- Toys for kids
- Dry Cleaning
- Health club / gym
- Taxi/Uber fares which are inevitable.
- Beauty (hair salon for hair cuts, color, nails, make up, etc)
- Extracurricular activities dues/fees
- Entertainment (movies, theatre, plays, Zoo, concerts, sporting events, etc --)
- Magazine/newspaper/Ipad subscriptions
- Dining out at restaurants
- Grocery budget
- Retirement savings contributions
- Kids college fund savings contributions
- Charity/donations
- Travel / vacation expenses
- Federal/State/local income taxes
- Any revolving debt payments you might have
- Bad habit type stuff (alcohol, smoking, etc)
- Emergency savings fund for any major health issues
- Non reimbursed office/work expenses and supplies

I enjoy his posts but I agree there is no possible way he is only spending that little money on groceries for a family of 4. I spend that much just alone on groceries. Supermarkets here aren't cheap. Not sure what he is eating. I read some locals calling him out on that little budget. I don't know anyone with a family that spends that little. He also admitted to not including dining out and then forgetting to add in gasoline.

Even my friends that own cars routinely use taxis or Ubers. I do agree with his point that if you own a paid off place here you can get by reasonably ok. Cheaper than many places around the world.

 

[Che Vos]

As a couple or single person with paid off place one can live off $1600/mo.


Even less so if you remove cleaning and delivery services. Would be too bare bones for many - add in travel, entertainment, etc and cost goes back up.

Look at that salary of his employee. An embarrassment. Slave wage.

 

[MikeYoung]

As a couple or single person with paid off place one can live off $1600/mo.


Even less so if you remove cleaning and delivery services. Would be too bare bones for many - add in travel, entertainment, etc and cost goes back up.

That grocery has to be a typo. I spend more than that in BA for grocery store each month just for myself. He is claiming $125 dollars a week with 4 people? Ain't no way.

 

[Darksider415]

At the end of our time in BA, my wife and I, by ourselves, were averaging between 200k and 250k ARS/week (130-160 USD when the dollar was around 1500 in November/December) in groceries, and we were getting most of our stuff from the store brands to save a few pesos.

While we're waiting for our house to be finished here in Rio, we're staying with friends of ours and covering groceries to lighten the load. With four adults, a teenager and two toddlers, we're averaging around 1250 BRL/week, so at today's exchange rate, around 330k ARS or 236 USD, and we absolutely are not searching for the cheapest things on the shelves either.

Based on that, I've got my doubts about Mara's budgeting.

 

[CraigM]

I have no doubt what folks are saying here but even if you doubled that budget it would be cheap compared to life in the US. Kids are so expensive here, especially teenage girls. Our monthly amazon bill alone is more than any item on his list.

 

[ElQueso]

At the end of our time in BA, my wife and I, by ourselves, were averaging between 200k and 250k ARS/week (130-160 USD when the dollar was around 1500 in November/December) in groceries, and we were getting most of our stuff from the store brands to save a few pesos.

While we're waiting for our house to be finished here in Rio, we're staying with friends of ours and covering groceries to lighten the load. With four adults, a teenager and two toddlers, we're averaging around 1250 BRL/week, so at today's exchange rate, around 330k ARS or 236 USD, and we absolutely are not searching for the cheapest things on the shelves either.

Based on that, I've got my doubts about Mara's budgeting.

There is no way a family of 4 can spend that little. In Argentina everyone has their motivations for posting what they do. I took a look and he is marketing immigration services to Argentina so he probably has a vested interest in folks moving here and making it sound like it's cheaper. Anyone that is trying to sell these kind of services doesn't get much business if you say it is expensive. I would have to think anyone marketing immigration services to Argentina has been suffering the past few years.

On the contrary my X feed is chock full of people trying to market immigration services to Paraguay. Immigration attorneys pay these cockroaches fees to market their services for any given country. That is probably what we are seeing here with him. It is common sense that there is no way a household of 4 is spending that little on groceries in BA.

I have no doubt what folks are saying here but even if you doubled that budget it would be cheap compared to life in the US. Kids are so expensive here, especially teenage girls. Our monthly amazon bill alone is more than any item on his list.

Agree that life with kids is just insane today. My sister has 2 kids and I almost vomit when I hear how much money she spends with them.

 

[earlyretirement]

I have no doubt what folks are saying here but even if you doubled that budget it would be cheap compared to life in the US. Kids are so expensive here, especially teenage girls. Our monthly amazon bill alone is more than any item on his list.

I totally agree with you Craig. Life in the USA is so expensive with kids. I have 3 kids and people would be shocked at how much we spend on them. (I get shocked myself just looking at some of the bills each month). Especially if you have children that are involved with sports at competitive level. When I open my Country Club statement each month it is an eye opener. The actual monthly bill wouldn't be too bad $850/month but then when you add on tennis lessons, swim lessons, golf lessons, misc events it adds up. The positive thing is my daughter was a 4 year Varsity athlete in both tennis and swimming. Son is in multiple sports, my youngest is getting really good at golf even at 10 years old. But these add up.

Not to mention all the other stuff like clothes, and exactly as you mentioned @CraigM - Amazon! We literally get an Amazon package every single day. No exaggeration. Every day. And don't get me started on teenage girls. I don't know how but just the shampoo/conditioner/beauty stuff/creams/lotion bill has to make any male shocked. LOL.

My actually are thinking about moving abroad to give my other kids an experience and to save some money as life in California is so expensive. We even considered Buenos Aires as I have an office there. But here is the rub. In doing the math, right now we wouldn't be saving much money. As already mentioned, not sure how BowTiedMara spends so little on dining out but to have the same kind of lifestyle (going to dine out often), buying lots of fresh and high quality groceries, events, cars, kids good schools we wouldn't be saving money.

We live in one of the best school districts in the State and public schools are probably as good as many private schools. In Buenos Aires to send them to a really good elite school we would be looking at about $30,000 USD per kid or $60,000 per year as my daughter is going off to University this fall so we only have 2. Rents in a luxurious property are not cheap in Buenos Aires, HOA fees are insane for a big property in a high end building. Cars are more expensive, Restaurant prices at nice restaurants we like going out were honestly about the same as what we spend in San Diego.

The areas where we would spend less are activities and things like swimming lessons, tennis lessons, etc. But by and large, life in Buenos Aires for the same lifestyle we live wouldn't be much less. Obviously you can do Buenos Aires much more affordably but I think it's really important for people to do an apples to apples comparison when deciding to move to another place and not enough people really do that.

Moving to a Country like Argentina is a LOT easier as a single person or even a couple with no kids. But once you add kids into the equation things are much different. Two of my kids were born in Argentina. I decided to raise them in the USA when my daughter was 3 before she started school. I wanted to give them the best shot at a good quality of life, great education, safe, and most important a fundamental understanding of hard work, good ethics and stable environment. Argentina was NOT that.

I believe Argentina is a great place to move to if you are retired. But honestly I wouldn't really recommend it for a family with kids to raise.

 

[JonJLA]

Definitely agree that kids are the big difference. I have some friends that moved to Brazil and Argentina with kids. They enjoyed their time there but their kids were not able to get into good colleges. They ended up going to private universities in Brazil and Argentina which I believe are decent but their job prospects were slim to none when they finished. I would probably worry about that.

 

[Darksider415]

Definitely agree that kids are the big difference. I have some friends that moved to Brazil and Argentina with kids. They enjoyed their time there but their kids were not able to get into good colleges. They ended up going to private universities in Brazil and Argentina which I believe are decent but their job prospects were slim to none when they finished. I would probably worry about that.

At least speaking on the Brazilian side, if they get into a federal university here, they're set. If they can't get into a federal or a good state one like UERJ, then they're borderline SOL without going abroad, and that's without factoring in the difference in cultural work ethic.

That's a concern for my wife and I as we're starting to plan for kids. I'm already looking into schools that align with both the US and Brazilian standards, so when we do get to that point, they have options if they can't get into a good federal university.

 

[JonJLA]

At least speaking on the Brazilian side, if they get into a federal university here, they're set. If they can't get into a federal or a good state one like UERJ, then they're borderline SOL without going abroad, and that's without factoring in the difference in cultural work ethic.

That's a concern for my wife and I as we're starting to plan for kids. I'm already looking into schools that align with both the US and Brazilian standards, so when we do get to that point, they have options if they can't get into a good federal university.

Thanks for sharing. I don't know enough about the difference between federal or good state universities. I was told that my friend's kid went to a good university in Brazil. I will ask which one. But coming out of school and applying for good positions in the US they did not get hired competing against kids coming out of top tier American Universities. I don't know anything about it only that my friend was complaining about his kids still being on the payroll because of that. He commented to me if he could have done it over he would have pushed them to go to American universities.

 

[Edmonton]

At least speaking on the Brazilian side, if they get into a federal university here, they're set. If they can't get into a federal or a good state one like UERJ, then they're borderline SOL without going abroad, and that's without factoring in the difference in cultural work ethic.

That's a concern for my wife and I as we're starting to plan for kids. I'm already looking into schools that align with both the US and Brazilian standards, so when we do get to that point, they have options if they can't get into a good federal university.

One thing I can't wrap my head around is how expensive some of the schools are there in BA. Most of my friends are paying at least $700 bucks a month. How is that guy on X paying so little? Or are they not English schools? @Darksider415 are the schools in Brazil expensive too? Or is this an Argentina thing?

I would love to have kids but I am not sure I could afford them!

 

[Darksider415]

Thanks for sharing. I don't know enough about the difference between federal or good state universities. I was told that my friend's kid went to a good university in Brazil. I will ask which one. But coming out of school and applying for good positions in the US they did not get hired competing against kids coming out of top tier American Universities. I don't know anything about it only that my friend was complaining about his kids still being on the payroll because of that. He commented to me if he could have done it over he would have pushed them to go to American universities.

For what it's worth, the absolute top-ranked Brazilian university is USP, which is roughly equal in ranking to the University of Wisconsin-Madison. The top-ranked Argentine one is UBA, which is roughly on par with Penn State.

But, outside of the four top schools in Brazil and the top two in Argentina, neither country has any representation in the top 500 universities worldwide, while the US has over 70 schools, both public and private on the same list.

 

[Dick]

I have no doubt what folks are saying here but even if you doubled that budget it would be cheap compared to life in the US. Kids are so expensive here, especially teenage girls. Our monthly amazon bill alone is more than any item on his list.

I have 3 adult daughters. Last one just went off to college and finally an empty nester. I feel your pain Craig! I think my monthly Amazon bill was more than that guys entire budget!

On the contrary my X feed is chock full of people trying to market immigration services to Paraguay. Immigration attorneys pay these cockroaches fees to market their services for any given country. That is probably what we are seeing here with him. It is common sense that there is no way a household of 4 is spending that little on groceries in BA.

That makes sense. I took a look at that budget and it was obviously made it. I am alone right now and even without the wife I spend more than that. I like going out to eat but that can get expensive. Quality ingredients here cost about the same. Many things are impossible to get here. I find cheeses and yogurts here especially expensive which makes no sense since there are so many dairy cows here. How does that make sense?

That explains if he is trying to market people to move to Argentina why he would make the numbers lower. I looked into healthcare insurance here and it is expensive.His business is probably suffering if he is trying to market Argentina as a low cost destination. It is less than the States but it is relative because the salaries here are a pittance of what they are in the States.

Thanks for sharing. I don't know enough about the difference between federal or good state universities. I was told that my friend's kid went to a good university in Brazil. I will ask which one. But coming out of school and applying for good positions in the US they did not get hired competing against kids coming out of top tier American Universities. I don't know anything about it only that my friend was complaining about his kids still being on the payroll because of that. He commented to me if he could have done it over he would have pushed them to go to American universities.

I met a few people here that have adult kids. Some still live at home. That seems cultural here. I am not sure how the typical Porteño would stack up against someone for a job. From my experiences here there is a lack of work ethic. No one wants to work too hard which is the opposite of the States.

 

[sophos]

Based on that, I've got my doubts about Mara's budgeting.

You have to take a grain of salt with anyone pushes residential services to move to a country. I took a brief look at his X and he is posting all pro-Milei agenda and acting like everything is positive in Argentina. It is ok to do that but one has to consider that he probably has an agenda on posting low prices.

 

[earlyretirement]

Thanks for sharing. I don't know enough about the difference between federal or good state universities. I was told that my friend's kid went to a good university in Brazil. I will ask which one. But coming out of school and applying for good positions in the US they did not get hired competing against kids coming out of top tier American Universities. I don't know anything about it only that my friend was complaining about his kids still being on the payroll because of that. He commented to me if he could have done it over he would have pushed them to go to American universities.

That was my concern! I'd love to get my kids off the "payroll" as soon as possible. University is going to be brutal. Just terrible. Tuition costs in the USA have gotten insane even for mediocre Universities but the top tier highly ranked schools are just insane unless you are poor in which case many will give a lot of assistance.

I just wanted to give my kids a leg up and give them the chance to have an American education. I loved growing up here and going through the education system and did ok for myself. I truly believe you stack up someone that went to a South American university and a good top American university and 9/10 times they will get the job vs. the other.

But I just wanted to give my kids a good work ethic. In Argentina it's kind of a zoo with the mentality of things.

I believe heading into the future a kid is going to have to have every edge to get a good job. As AI and technology take over you're going to see a lot of kids struggling to get high paying jobs out of University. I'm already seeing it now. I can't imagine how it will be in the future. It's going to take getting a good education, networking, and especially doing great internships. I just don't see drive in Argentina from almost anyone compared to the USA, the best country in the world.

 

[FuturoBA]

The median salary in Argentina is very low. The fact that he pays so little to his nanny shows you just how low salaries are. I know BowTied Mara and he is a great guy. I meet up and have a meal with him each trip. Still, as a father with 3 kids I can tell you that there are a bunch of things left off on that list. I don't believe that amount for groceries for 2 kids and a family of 4.

He also put on that, he didn't include amounts dining out. I am a #'s guy and if you're making a budget I'd include all of these things. I don't see a lot of different expenses related to the kids. I had 2 kids born in Buenos Aires and my youngest lived there until she was 3 and we had a ton of expenses for the kids. Obviously, life is much cheaper without kids but I've found that when most people are making a budget like this they are vastly underestimating actual expenses each month.

-Rent (if you don't own your property)
- Property taxes if you own
-Phone (Land line and Cell phone)
- Utilities (gas, water, electricity, cable, internet, etc)
- HOA fees/expensas each month
- Maintenance and repairs (if you own a property)
- Car payments
- Car insurance
- Auto Fuel each month for each car
- Registration fees for your car each year
- Maintenance on your car to include car washes and oil changes
-Parking (various times when you're out and about plus if you don't have a garage in your apartment and have to rent one)
- Home/rental insurance for your property
- Life insurance
- Health insurance premiums
- Dental insurance premiums
- Medical/Dental expenses (what insurance won't cover)
- Prescription medications
- School expenses for kids if applicable (tuition, stuff for school, ballet classes, etc)
- Babysitter expenses
- Annual fee for Credit Cards
- Clothes for kids and yourself
- Toys for kids
- Dry Cleaning
- Health club / gym
- Taxi/Uber fares which are inevitable.
- Beauty (hair salon for hair cuts, color, nails, make up, etc)
- Extracurricular activities dues/fees
- Entertainment (movies, theatre, plays, Zoo, concerts, sporting events, etc --)
- Magazine/newspaper/Ipad subscriptions
- Dining out at restaurants
- Grocery budget
- Retirement savings contributions
- Kids college fund savings contributions
- Charity/donations
- Travel / vacation expenses
- Federal/State/local income taxes
- Any revolving debt payments you might have
- Bad habit type stuff (alcohol, smoking, etc)
- Emergency savings fund for any major health issues
- Non reimbursed office/work expenses and supplies

So true about additional expenses and non-recurring expenses that don't show up every month that one needs to budget for. I remember seeing a report that 40% of Americans wouldn't be able to cover a $400 sudden expense.

When budgeting I like to think of it in terms of levels.

• survivor/lean
• comfortable
• modest
• lavish

For comfortable and above each will have their own definitions, but especially for those on a fixed income to know what level they afford to live at and what sacrifices they are willing to give up if they need to drop down.

I enjoy his posts but I agree there is no possible way he is only spending that little money on groceries for a family of 4. I spend that much just alone on groceries. Supermarkets here aren't cheap. Not sure what he is eating. I read some locals calling him out on that little budget. I don't know anyone with a family that spends that little. He also admitted to not including dining out and then forgetting to add in gasoline.

Even my friends that own cars routinely use taxis or Ubers. I do agree with his point that if you own a paid off place here you can get by reasonably ok. Cheaper than many places around the world.

That grocery has to be a typo. I spend more than that in BA for grocery store each month just for myself. He is claiming $125 dollars a week with 4 people? Ain't no way.

Wow has groceries really gotten that expensive? Still here in the states I can cover my entire food budget for < $400 a month. Of course that's on the low end when I'm not eating out as often, but for just for just grocery it's rarely more than that. I guess it depends on what you're buying as some things will be cheaper and as always others more expensive. How's the cost of meats, fruits, and vegetables now a days?