Economy Argentina isn't the affordable option

[dandy]

Just in case Argentina gets dollarised and expensive, here's where you can go for less than current Argentine prices:

 

[Redpoint]

Just in case Argentina gets dollarised and expensive, here's where you can go for less than current Argentine prices:

Turkey is the cheapest place to live? This guy doesn't know what he is talking about.

 

[roland]

Add up everything in life......I'll bet that Argentina is the cheapest place....unless you can live without running water....It is cheaper than the Philippines, D.R., Mexico, Colombia, Thailand, C.R.

 

[dark]

Add up everything in life......I'll bet that Argentina is the cheapest place....unless you can live without running water....It is cheaper than the Philippines, D.R., Mexico, Colombia, Thailand, C.R.

Please its certainly not cheaper than the phillipines as food prices ,rental prices, cars furniture , clothing are double in us dollars than anywhere in that country

 

[earlyretirement]

Add up everything in life......I'll bet that Argentina is the cheapest place....unless you can live without running water....It is cheaper than the Philippines, D.R., Mexico, Colombia, Thailand, C.R.

Yes, it's very cheap in Argentina. Even if Argentina ever could truly dollarize (I don't see that happening anytime soon). It won't be expensive like it was before.

I'm not sure if Argentina is cheaper than Bangkok. I was just there not long ago and it was very very very very cheap. If it weren't for the horrible hot and humid weather it would be great. I took a family of 5 to eat a delicious and fresh meal and it was only around $20 US. No where even in Buenos Aires you can eat that cheap. Some places like Terminal 21 upstairs in the food court where you had fabulous food that was really fresh we had meals for as low as $12 for the 5 of us.

Things like 1 hour massage in Bangkok (and much of Thailand) I was paying $6 US per hour. In Buenos Aires I pay $10 per hour at a comparable place.

In Buenos Aires at most places were were still spending on average about $70 US dollars for the 5 of us by the time you added up appetizers, main entre, drinks and dessert.

Some of these places this guy is saying are affordable, aren't really that affordable. Colombia isn't really cheap. And he mentions Cali which is a complete DUMP. No one would want to live there. Colombia things are expensive. Food isn't too cheap, electricty is expensive. He mentions Cartagena which is way overpriced. I find most cities in Colombia to be a dump.

Argentina is VERY cheap and the quality of life is amazing here. Especially Buenos Aires. NOT a place to live if you have to make money here but if RETIREMENT is where you want to live, I don't think it gets any better. I've been to over 575+ cities around the world. About 125 countries. Buenos Aires is amazing to retire to.

 

[earlyretirement]

Please its certainly not cheaper than the phillipines as food prices ,rental prices, cars furniture , clothing are double in us dollars than anywhere in that country

dark,

Where are you living these days? Where did you retire to?

 

[dandy]

Yes, it's very cheap in Argentina. Even if Argentina ever could truly dollarize (I don't see that happening anytime soon). It won't be expensive like it was before.

I'm not sure if Argentina is cheaper than Bangkok. I was just there not long ago and it was very very very very cheap. If it weren't for the horrible hot and humid weather it would be great. I took a family of 5 to eat a delicious and fresh meal and it was only around $20 US. No where even in Buenos Aires you can eat that cheap. Some places like Terminal 21 upstairs in the food court where you had fabulous food that was really fresh we had meals for as low as $12 for the 5 of us.

Things like 1 hour massage in Bangkok (and much of Thailand) I was paying $6 US per hour. In Buenos Aires I pay $10 per hour at a comparable place.

In Buenos Aires at most places were were still spending on average about $70 US dollars for the 5 of us by the time you added up appetizers, main entre, drinks and dessert.

Some of these places this guy is saying are affordable, aren't really that affordable. Colombia isn't really cheap. And he mentions Cali which is a complete DUMP. No one would want to live there. Colombia things are expensive. Food isn't too cheap, electricty is expensive. He mentions Cartagena which is way overpriced. I find most cities in Colombia to be a dump.

Argentina is VERY cheap and the quality of life is amazing here. Especially Buenos Aires. NOT a place to live if you have to make money here but if RETIREMENT is where you want to live, I don't think it gets any better. I've been to over 575+ cities around the world. About 125 countries. Buenos Aires is amazing to retire to.

The problem is that Argentina is unpredictable. Other less developed countries have more consistent prices and less volatility.

 

[walter50]

Going from Argentina to Turkey LOL—now that's quite the cultural shift! The idea of Argentina adopting dollarization seems like wishful thinking from those who might not fully grasp the complexities of the situation. It's not a straightforward solution, and the notion that it will seamlessly address Argentina's challenges appears somewhat naive.

 

[dandy]

Going from Argentina to Turkey LOL—now that's quite the cultural shift! The idea of Argentina adopting dollarization seems like wishful thinking from those who might not fully grasp the complexities of the situation. It's not a straightforward solution, and the notion that it will seamlessly address Argentina's challenges appears somewhat naive.

Why is it considered wishful thinking? After all, Argentina wouldn't be the pioneer in adopting dollarization. Referring to people as 'stupid' for entertaining the idea might be a bit harsh. Were you around during the Menem era with the 1 peso-1 dollar policy? Back then, many doubted its feasibility, yet it happened. Unfortunately, the government didn't adhere to the convertibility law. The argument for dollarization is that it could enforce compliance.

 

[Ron]

I lived off and on in Bangkok for a number of years. I left a little over four years ago. I would say that in general Argentina is much less expensive, but for those looking for a super cheap existence Bangkok does provide those as well. That existence arrives with a very spartan studio where you rent a fridge, a TV, and other "luxuries". Also eating street food on a regular basis. I know a number of expats who have that lifestyle. If you get out of Bangkok living can be even less expensive.

 

[hunt]

I believe I am the only one qualified to compare Bangkok and Buenos Aires with real prices since I'm from Bangkok and I'm living in Buenos Aires now.
Given that we use dollar blue rate, there are a lot of things that are cheaper in Bangkok but there are things that are more expensive there as well. Bear in mind that BKK caters to all kinds of people, be it cheap or chic/fancy.
You can find a fully furnished modern condo with gym and swimming pool etc etc say 30 sq.m studio for less than $300/month (this is based on where I was living alone near Rama IV Road). My electricity bill was normally around $25-30/month and the water bill was very cheap like $2/month.
A decent meal at a street-side shophouse-like restaurant costs around $1.5-2. If you eat at a restaurant in a shopping mall normally it would cost you around $10++ depending on what and where but if you go to the food court, you can get something from $3-5.
@earlyretirement Terminal 21's food court is much cheaper than others because they intended to make it cheap to attract tourists but if you go to other food courts lat Siam Paragon or MBK, it will probably be double or more.
Starbucks is cheaper in Buenos Aires. I had an iced grande Americano for $2 here. I believe Starbucks in BKK is the same price as in the US.
I bought a kilo of beef here for $2. Beef is hard to compare because beef in Thailand is expensive and the quality varies depending on where and which cuts you buy. Normal beef you buy at a wet market costs $9/kg but we're talking super tough and tooth-pooling sticky beef. Farm-raised high quality beef might range from $20-35/kg. Wine in Thailand is expensive due to high import tax. The cheapest drinkable bottle costs $14 while here it's $1-2 and it might even taste better. Produce isn't that different but we do have a lot of wet markets throughout the countries where things are a lot cheaper than air-conditioned supermarkets. Taxi, subway and skytrain are more expensive than taxi and subte here. Here subte costs nothing while in BKK you're charged by the distance. A single ride ranges from $0.5-2 depending on how far you go.

 

[Travis]

The problem is that Argentina is unpredictable. Other less developed countries have more consistent prices and less volatility.

The lack of stability is the one thing about Argentina that really bothers me.
You just don't have any way to know what tomorrow may bring.

 

[dandy]

The lack of stability is the one thing about Argentina that really bothers me.
You just don't have any way to know what tomorrow may bring.

This is why Argentina may not be a preferred retirement destination for many individuals. In contrast, Mexico actively encourages North Americans to retire there, boasting a more stable environment than Argentina. Notably, there are tens of thousands of Canadians and US citizens residing in expat hubs like San Miguel de Allende and Ajijic. These locales offer a lifestyle that provides the support of an active foreign community, which may not be as readily found in Argentina. In Argentina, a retiree must be more self-reliant, willing to learn Spanish, and integrate into the local culture. Moreover, they must be adaptable to the inevitable shifts in the economy and political landscape. While some may find this exhilarating, those seeking a tranquil, warm climate and peace of mind might find greater happiness elsewhere.

 

[earlyretirement]

The problem is that Argentina is unpredictable. Other less developed countries have more consistent prices and less volatility.

Yes, for sure it's unpredictable. However, I found if you have purchased a home/apartment that's your main cost. Property is relatively cheap right now. It's fallen for many years in a row. It's bottomed out or a few quarters from bottoming out. You can buy a really nice brand new construction property for around $150,000 and expenses are dirt cheap. Utility bills are next to nothing. I believe this is the bottom. I called it correctly in 2002 buying up as much real estate as I could in Buenos Aires for a few years after that. At my peak I owned 15 properties in Bueno Aires. I sold most of my properties at the peak in 2018 and 2019 for pretty insane prices and I've been waiting a few years for an opportunity like this again.

You get that taken care of and it doesn't matter if Argentina is "unpredictable". You can live a good life for not too much money. I don't really see that changing. The key is to OWN a place of your own and not get stuck renting. I kept 2 properties and never sold and even during the tremendous turmoil in Argentina they have consistently stayed rented and made over $1,200 US each per month.

The key in Argentina is to take advantage of the boom and bust cycles. There is LOTS of money to be made there. The problem is people think things are going to be great forever and then they think they will fall forever. Things don't move in straight lines forever. You can't get emotional in Argentina. You just have to use logic and common sense.

Argentina is a dream to live in if you're retired and you have foreign currency and hard assets abroad so you have US dollars/Euros/Sterling/etc. and spending pesos. People in that situation will always do well in Argentina living.

 

[earlyretirement]

I lived off and on in Bangkok for a number of years. I left a little over four years ago. I would say that in general Argentina is much less expensive, but for those looking for a super cheap existence Bangkok does provide those as well. That existence arrives with a very spartan studio where you rent a fridge, a TV, and other "luxuries". Also eating street food on a regular basis. I know a number of expats who have that lifestyle. If you get out of Bangkok living can be even less expensive.

The "street food" in Bangkok is pretty darn good. Did you ever go eat at Terminal 21 ? How do they make money there? Some of the dishes are only like $1.50 US including full protein. I was blown away how delicious and how fresh and cheap it was.

I was incredibly impressed with how efficient and organized of a system they have with those refillable plastic cards so vendors/restaurants didn't have to deal with cash. I'm going to go back to Thailand next summer. I LOVED the people and culture there. So reverent and respectful culture and society.

 

[jackL]

The "street food" in Bangkok is pretty darn good. Did you ever go eat at Terminal 21 ? How do they make money there? Some of the dishes are only like $1.50 US including full protein. I was blown away how delicious and how fresh and cheap it was.

I was incredibly impressed with how efficient and organized of a system they have with those refillable plastic cards so vendors/restaurants didn't have to deal with cash. I'm going to go back to Thailand next summer. I LOVED the people and culture there. So reverent and respectful culture and society.

Greetings! Indeed, I've dined at Terminal 21, but the food didn't leave a lasting impression on me, although the prices were quite reasonable. More frequently, I opted for meals at Emporium, situated a bit further up Sukhumvit. However, the majority of my meals were sourced from street vendors in Lat Phrao, my place of residence, typically indulging in grilled chicken and sticky rice.

Choosing between Thailand and Buenos Aires is a tough call for me, but ultimately, the climate here takes the winning spot.

 

[earlyretirement]

I believe I am the only one qualified to compare Bangkok and Buenos Aires with real prices since I'm from Bangkok and I'm living in Buenos Aires now.
Given that we use dollar blue rate, there are a lot of things that are cheaper in Bangkok but there are things that are more expensive there as well. Bear in mind that BKK caters to all kinds of people, be it cheap or chic/fancy.
You can find a fully furnished modern condo with gym and swimming pool etc etc say 30 sq.m studio for less than $300/month (this is based on where I was living alone near Rama IV Road). My electricity bill was normally around $25-30/month and the water bill was very cheap like $2/month.
A decent meal at a street-side shophouse-like restaurant costs around $1.5-2. If you eat at a restaurant in a shopping mall normally it would cost you around $10++ depending on what and where but if you go to the food court, you can get something from $3-5.
@earlyretirement Terminal 21's food court is much cheaper than others because they intended to make it cheap to attract tourists but if you go to other food courts lat Siam Paragon or MBK, it will probably be double or more.
Starbucks is cheaper in Buenos Aires. I had an iced grande Americano for $2 here. I believe Starbucks in BKK is the same price as in the US.
I bought a kilo of beef here for $2. Beef is hard to compare because beef in Thailand is expensive and the quality varies depending on where and which cuts you buy. Normal beef you buy at a wet market costs $9/kg but we're talking super tough and tooth-pooling sticky beef. Farm-raised high quality beef might range from $20-35/kg. Wine in Thailand is expensive due to high import tax. The cheapest drinkable bottle costs $14 while here it's $1-2 and it might even taste better. Produce isn't that different but we do have a lot of wet markets throughout the countries where things are a lot cheaper than air-conditioned supermarkets. Taxi, subway and skytrain are more expensive than taxi and subte here. Here subte costs nothing while in BKK you're charged by the distance. A single ride ranges from $0.5-2 depending on how far you go.

Thank for that really detailed explanation on Bangkok. This is why I love these forums. The sharing of valuable information. Yes, when I looked at apartment rental prices on long term rentals in Bangkok, I saw some nice ones for about $500 US per month which more or less matches what you're saying. I looked at 1 bedroom units.

Yes, I ate in Siam Paragon and MBK too and you're exactly correct. Those places were about double or 2.5 X the price of Terminal 21. You mentioned they are trying to attract tourists but we went there for 4 days in a row and I mostly saw locals not tourists eating there. A local explained to me they make it cheap so locals don't cook and just eat out. I don't understand why anyone would cook if they can get delicious food like that for so cheap. We had many dishes at Terminal 21 and the proteins and vegetables were super fresh and delicious. We tried many stalls and most were less than $2 US per person. It was unbelievable. And I'm not talking super small portion. Enough food to fill you up.

I really appreciate your detailed prices on Bangkok and I find it's spot on target. I stayed at the Hyatt Regency and I'm a Globalist. They upgraded us to a HUGE suite. They had free dinner at night in the Club Lounge but we only went up there for the wine, as you noted it's not cheap there. But I refused to eat there Free as food was so delicious and cheap in Terminal 21 a few blocks away. However, the breakfast was AMAZING at the Hyatt Regency. One of the best in all my travels around the world. The French Toast was incredible.

My kids were in heaven deciding all the stalls to eat at. We never had a bad meal in Bangkok and really all of Thailand. I love your country. We visited Bangkok, Chiang Mai, Koh Samui, Phuket. I fell in love with your culture and people there.

Just out of curiosity, what brought you to Buenos Aires? Which do you like better? The only thing I didn't like about Bangkok was the horrible heat and humidity. I couldn't stand that all the time. Also, the traffic is pretty horrendous. I didn't use the public transport as I had a driver.

 

[earlyretirement]

Here is a photo from one of the places we ate that was delicious. 30 Baht = $0.80 cents. 50 Baht = $1.35 US. It was incredible! Huge portion and quality of the food was great. For a family of 5 I don't think we ever spent more than $8 US for dinner at Terminal 21. Do they make any money at those prices???

 

[earlyretirement]

The lack of stability is the one thing about Argentina that really bothers me.
You just don't have any way to know what tomorrow may bring.

But stability how? What do you want to be more stable? Certain parts of the country are a mess but the city even today with all the economic mess is relatively safe. Even today I can walk over most parts of the CABA without worrying. I was walking around all of Recoleta and Palermo at 1 or 2 AM and never fear for my safety.

Food is delicious and cheap. Ubers/taxis are cheap. $2.5 to go across town. I'm just curious what you want to see more stable? Like specifics? Definitely for sure things can improve but considering all the economic mess there I find it's remarkable. Look at many aspects of the USA and things are f*cked up here.

Take a look what is going on in the USA now. People are totally clueless and blind to what is happening. Or they are in denial.Look what is going on in cities like San Francisco Bay Area. Many areas no matter where you are cars are getting broken into - https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8j73Hey/

https://tiktok.com/@chismetimenews/video/7233634191320026410?
_t=8fmag4JS6FW&_r=1

Take a look at many major cities in the USA and everything under the sun is getting locked up! I was in Los Angeles and literally EVERYTHING was locked up behind security cases.Spam locked up

https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jvLurh/

https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jv19Lv/

Hell, even Spam is being locked up in many cities. SPAM!

In many Target stores across the USA everything is locked up - https://tiktok.com/@wayoldgay/video/7166298488337124651?_r=1&_t=8fmaTeTKyWA

And many cities you have incidents like this where there is NO fear of being prosecuted - https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jvRudb/

Now go to a city like Buenos Aires and things are calm. The economy has gone to sh*t but people are civilized and you don't see much of the things you are seeing now in the USA.People are in denial in the USA. There is a shitstorm coming in 2024 and 2025. Commercial real estate bottom is going to come out. That's going to cause a domino effect across the economy.

 

[earlyretirement]

I don’t want to paint the wrong picture that the USA is dangerous because it’s not. Much of the USA is amazing and beautiful and safe. HOWEVER, things here with the economy are a mess and it's going to get worse in 2024 and 2025.


People don't want to acknowledge what is going on. The mainstream media doesn't really talk about it much as to not cause a panic. Take a look below what is happening every day here. In many areas, people can't even afford groceries.


2024 and 2025 are going to get worse. You are going to see people desperate here. Going out to eat at restaurants is insanely expensive in many major cities here.


Nashville, St Louis, Detroit


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jE2aux/


NYC. https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jE2rTC/


Chicago, Stockton, Lubbock, Detroit, New Orleans, Baltimore, Albuquerque, Oakland, St. Louis. Memphis - https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jEeV1W/


Shopping Malls even in affluent cities in California are all getting robbed. Orange County, San Diego. (I'm not talking about trashy areas. I'm talking about some of the most affluent areas and pockets of wealth in the USA).


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jE1DYn/


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jEYmFq/


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jEMY5D/


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jKEdn7/


https://tiktok.com/t/ZT8jEFjRP/

So yes, I agree with you that things in Argentina are unstable. But you know what? They are here in the USA as well. Most of my adult life, I've done very well watching for trends and acting on them at the right time. I own an investment company and we've pretty much nailed most of the last economic boom and bust cycles in several countries.